The most famous MFT lens gets discontinued! 20mm f/1.7 officially out of production.

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Panasonic Japan officially announced that the production of the 20mm f/1.7 lens ceased. And a rumor I was just working with one of my trusted sources was that there will be a replacement coming soon. This is already a very good lens and let’s hope Panasonic can make it even more better with the new generation.

The lens is still one of the most sold at Amazon US (ranking here). Always on top 10 since the day it was launched!

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  • ssgreenley

    So I guess this will be one of those updated lenses to be re-released. I suspect there should be some happy readers if/when the AF performance improves!

    • Pharque Moi

      I love love love my 20/1.7

      • andrew

        +1

  • Phil

    Maybe…..a 1.4 instead????

    • f/1.4 would be very hard to implement in a pancake. And, considering quality of modern sensors and this particular focal length, mostly wasted.

      Panny, keep it as it is – just upgrade the AF!

      • peevee

        It is the new world coming… the world of f/1.8 ZOOMS!
        In this new world, f/1.7 single FL does not make much sense. And if you look at 20/1.7, the front element is tiny, much smaller than the diameter of the lens. It can be made brighter just with the bigger front element, probably made from the glass with higher diffraction index, without making the lens itself any bigger.

        • > “It is the new world coming… the world of f/1.8 ZOOMS!”

          Those zooms don’t matter, I want the 20mm f/1.7 as it means an awesome fast lens on my GX1 *but* is still very portable! A zoom wouldn’t be.

          If they make any significant changes I hope it is making it even smaller ;-) :-P

    • jose_e

      panny wouldn’t have a 20mm f/1.4 right alongside its 25mm f/1.4.

      they know a huge reason it is loved is because of its size. they better keep the size, keep the max aperture, keep the focal length… but improve its focusing. and knowing the way things go, that means they also get to bump up the price. the replacement will be at least $400

      • bookervrk

        Perhaps the replacement for pancake 20/1.7 is 17.5mm F1.4 lens?

        • Narretz

          There are already two from Oly and one from Nokton. The 20 mm is special, not only because of size and performance, but because the focal length is very natural.

    • MJr

      Likely no change at all, just fast AF and the new design.

  • Tron

    Maybe the replacement will have OIS? Hopefully not more expensive if it does.

    • Pharque Moi

      Who needs OIS??

      • people with Panasonic cameras ;)

        with an Olympus camera … every lens has IS from the camera body

  • donsantos

    Same optical properties with silent internal focusing please.

    • Anonymous

      exactly… optically it’s my favourite m43 lens, just a bit faster focussing and it would be perfect!

  • Dr. Poop

    oh man! If there is Weather sealing and internal zoom in a Smaller form? Take my money now Panasonic!

    • E-1

      Internal zoom on a prime … right.

      • Captain Poop

        Have you met the 14mm/2.5? I’m preeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeetty sure it’s a prime with internal focusing.

        • Mr. Reeee

          Internal Zoom ≠ Internal Focus
          Two different animals.

          • MJr

            Did you google that symbol or what ?

            • Mr. Reeee

              It’s no big mystery. On a Mac you hit Option = to get ≠
              Or my fave, Option Shift = to get ± ;-)

              You can also activate the Keyboard & Character Viewer in Language & Text in System Prefs.

              My advice for Windows users? Get a Mac! ;-)

              • I second that advice!

              • MJr

                Will do. :P

              • Mac user here. Switch to mac is you are unsatisfied of windows. Or give Ubuntu a honest try.

                …but just for a character shortcut?!?

                • Vic

                  As a pc user, my answer is NO. Haha, anyways, how did we start this argument in a m43 site again? :D

                  • Phred

                    PC≠Mac
                    (thanks Mr. Reeee…the keystrokes work perfectly!)

              • I did type ≠ with “alt_=” on my linux box.

  • Mr. Poop

    didn’t see this coming. but I’m quite excited to see an update!!

  • gmill

    Where do we buy the new lens? Where is the Amazon link?
    Today

  • mahler

    Great! It is time that this lens with its mediocre, loud auto focus is discontinued and probably will be replaced. This lens was a bit overrated. Hopefully, the replacement will have at least the same IQ.

    • IT’S SOOOO OVERRATED…

      That its the No. 1 selling Micro Four Thirds Lens made. Mostly everyone who owns a MFT camera had one. It’s always on top of Amazons lens list.

      But you know.. HATERS GONNA HATE.

  • Anonymous

    Time to sell some lenses

  • hooooray … just about to pop mine on eBay will help the sale ;)

    • Anonymous

      I hope that was sarcasm. The price on ebay will certainly go down when everyone hears that there is a replacement coming. Luckily, I sold mine a while ago at a good price.

      • I’ll take on the challenge of competing with Panasonic’s supply chain (mine is in stock [on my desk] their replacement isn’t ever a rumor [yet])

        • Phred

          The lens ill go up in price on eBay.

  • BEST MFT LENS EVER

    I’m rocking with the 25mm right now, but I started MFT with the GF2 and the 20mm I’m gonna hold onto it though.. It’s officially a Collectors Item now!

    • Anonymous

      A discontinued lens that is not perfect and has been replaced by an upgrade is hardly a Collector’s [sic] item. I’ve a drawer full of such lenses that were replaced and quickly lost their value.

      • That’s nice.. But the Price went back up.

        You must have a lot of 4/3 lenses in that Drawer.

  • AMAZON HAS IT AT $399.00!!!
    • It’s now been discounted. It was $399.95 and now it’s only $399.00. Fabulous! I’ll have two. And a night out with the change.

  • MarcoSartoriPhoto

    I’m ready to read people complaining about the price, if version II has all the above mentioned features.

  • Narretz

    crazy, discontinued just like that. But I bet Pana has half a million backstock or os.

    • Well, it’s nothing but profit for them

      I haven’t seen this lens dip under $240.00

      • rpm40

        You saw this lens for $240? …Did you buy five?

        • got mine used for $200. can’t beat that!

          for the new version, if they just improve the af to current standards it’s a winner!

  • Ros

    faster faster make it faster!!!

  • pat

    keep the price and optics on line and speed up the AF and its a deal.

  • MarcoSartoriPhoto

    Off topic: is there some of you living in Marseille, France?

  • frankv

    A current and future classic. I can’t believe they stopped production. It holds up its price and its 2nd hand value, so this should be Panasonics’ “Nikon 50/1.2 MF” as I believe that one to also be still in production.

  • Don Pope

    Mo’ better!

  • They should work on new lenses instead of updating current ones. It’s not as if there’s nothing to add to m4/3 lens lineup…

    • CaverDave

      Totally agree. I have been waiting for the 42.5/1.2 since it was shown undder glass at Photokina last fall and it will not reach us until early 2014.

      Still an updated 20/1.7 will be a nice thing and should match up with the upcoming GX? camera body.

      Dave

    • Anonymous

      Yep, would love 7mm to 10mm prime lens with really good performance even in corners and can take filters.

  • Yes! Panny listened!!

    Now, Panny listen some more, that’s important: GX7 + 20mm Mk2 kit, please.

  • Anonymous

    So the GX bundles will be either 20mm or 20mm + new pancake zoom? Make that a 12 – 50 please :-)

  • SteveO

    Based on the 2nd generation 14-140m, I’m guessing smaller, faster, and if anything less expensive. It should also solve the artifact issues at high ISO’s when mounted on Olympus bodies (which I’ve yet to experience).

    Just checked B&H and the original is now selling for $428, highest I’ve seen it. I bought mine used for $200 last December, which now seems like a steal. It’s a keeper in all respects, I won’t be upgrading anytime soon.

  • i hear so many stories about the 20mm’s af speed, is it really that bad? cant imagine.

    • BdV

      AF is never fast enough, but on the (old) 20mm it’s fortunately not too slow either.

      • fast enough for bullets en flying cumshots you mean? lol

        • BdV

          Well, to be honest, I didn’t try either. (At least not with this lens.)

    • “i hear so many stories about the 20mm’s af speed, is it really that bad? cant imagine.”

      The 20mm uses an old AF motor tech. It is relatively slow (literally every other m43 lens is faster, including all pancakes) and it is also noisy.

      YouTube has a number of videos comparing the 20mm AF speed. For example:
      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iimG0kk57ZI
      or 20mm v. 25mm:
      http://youtu.be/i34FBAFEBUk?t=4m23s

      • Thanks for the link. Okayy the direct comparison with the 25mm shows a difference, but i guess its only important for action/fast movement based photography,which is not really one of the main strengths of mft anyway. Thats why i wondered about the many complainers.

        • Yeah, the speed is greatly eggagerated

          It may be slower than some MFT lenses, but for the highest selling MFT lens, it’s not slow enough to not have it in your stash.

          • OMega

            Depending on what body you use. It is now well known to be incompatible with the OM-D due to the banding issue and if what is stated below also an issue with the GH3 (which Panasonic apparently warn about), this is probably why it will be a major rebuild of the lens to find a cure for this ‘banding’ issue.

  • David B

    Omg I would love for that lens to be replaced with a new one!!!! it was my most favorite lens and it is so small in comparison with 25/1.4, it is just the AF on it is attrocious. A replacement with af like 14/2.5 (very fast) I’d be buying immediately if they don’t increase the form factor.

  • So faster internal AF … and heck make it an f/2.0 and even smaller

    But please, whatever its replaced by: make it in black!
    no more lilac lenses, no matter how good they are optically!

  • Newposter

    For sure this new version will be bundled with the new panasonic with a viewfinder. Then everyone will be happy?

    • Anonymous

      Not really, we will still want more lenses :-)

    • MJr

      Never!

  • ooooooooh, I’ve had an idea:
    – GX7 with a new 20/2.0 pancake as a kit

    (Pan’s response to the EP5 + 17/1.8 kit]

    • Phred

      20mm f/1.4 …let’s take it up a notch!

  • Use it on my GF1…beautiful lens.

  • Brian

    I would pay some serious money if it was magically stabilized. I’ve always wanted a stabilized 20 while shooting both video and photo on Panasonic bodies. I’m not counting on it, but I could always hope.

    • Nelson

      Yeah I wish it had OIS, I think Panasonic should see it’s mistake for not putting OIS on prime, even Canon have IS wide angle prime lens, I am sure Panasonic can do it too, though at expense of more bulk.

    • pizza4D

      Isn’t the next GX expected to have basic in-body image stabilization? I’d really like to see them make more lenses with OIS, especially primes with longer focal lengths, but why would they bother if they really intend to go for IBIS now as well?

  • J Shin

    As long as the replacement runs Android… :-)

    • Pharque Moi

      Android is for chumps.

      • OK. As long as the replacement is for chumps… :-)

  • Maybe this one won’t cause banding at high ISOs on an OM-D? Fingers crossed.

    • Anonymous

      I thought banding was more a sensor issue?

      • Anonymous

        The question of banding is a well known issue with the 20mm on an OM-D body.

      • Chez Wimpy

        It is a sensor issue… which is why the GH3 manual warns against it.

        • OMega

          Still means this lens is a no-no with the newer bodies, so is in need of a redesign.

        • OMega

          It is still an issue with the newer bodies, the lens is not fully compatible due to this issue. I would expect it to show with the EP-5 as well.

  • simon

    same optics (or 1.4 if not bigger of course :) faster af (that also works well with my om-d (the gf1 isn’t that much slower and actually in low light it has less trouble) and wheatersealing!
    that lens would be my nr. one priority imaging item to buy.

  • simon

    and yes, I don’t care for ois please don’t

  • JimD

    Methinks we may see a new camera with a m43 mount that has a larger sensor about APSC size. and Pany is widening their image circle correspondingly on new/replacement lenses. The new sensor output will be sized according to the lens mounted or from the control panel.
    And don’t go on about 4/3 is the format. The sensor can be any size that fits the mechanical boundaries. Its only a measurement.

    • dau

      Im no technical expert. Would or could this work?

      • Anonymous

        no

        • JimD

          And why not?

        • Anonytrackball

          Anon. You seem to know nothing! Make sure your future posts are as empty as your head.

      • JimD

        If you use a m lens on m43 most of the image is not used as there is no sensor to record the image that is outside the m43 sensor size. Many m43 lenses are also made for APSC. So if the m43 sensor was enlarged then these larger image circle lenses could be quite at home. I also believe that some of the m43 lenses currently made by Oly and pany have a larger image circle than m43. All that’s needed is a larger sensor and a switch to tell the camera use m43 size or use bigger as the sensor output.

        • This rumor has been going around for a while, and JimD is absolutely right about it being technically possible.

          The quibble below about the name seems silly. True, 4/3 refers to the aspect ratio as well as the sensor size (which is similar to 4/3″ video tube format), but there is no moral, ethical, legal, linguistic, or profit-driven reason why the sensor size cannot be changed with the same name.

          Just in photography: Panasonic’s multiaspect sensor already does that. 120 film format was very multi-aspect and multi-size, going from 645 to 617. 35mm film actually has two main formats: “full frame” for photography and “half frame” for cinema, which was actually used first, until Leica doubled it. APS was a multi-format standard.

          The question is, what it will be called? Mini 4/3 and Mega 4/3 would make sense, but they would also abbreviate to m43. Too confusing. APS 4/3 would abbreviate to A43, which sounds like a Sony model. How about Kilo 4/3 (k43) ? :-)

          • Anonymous

            Sorry but there is a very good reason for not changing sensor size unless you also change the name.

            The reason is simple: if you go buy an EF-S lens for example, you expect it to work on you EF-S camera without extreme vignetting, and you expect this to happen without significant cropping.

            Doing what jimd suggests without changing the name is a very good way to confuse the hell out of people and makes the name totally meaningless.

            There is a very good reason for Nikon and Canon alike to use different names for their aps-c and full frame cameras and lenses, despite the mounts being essentially the same (and people still get confused by it at times)

            • JimD

              Don’t be so damned stupid and pedantic.
              Call it m43plus.
              That do you.

              I also advocated a switch for native m43 mode as used now, an a new mode using larger sensor. All this can be done via the contacts for native mode.

              Did your teacher ever tell you that you had no vision and were blinkered.

              • Anonymous

                you know jimd, insulting is a rather clear sign of your inability to have a normal discussion, and it makes clear you have no proper arguments.

                Rather, you want something, and everything that is inconvenient for what you want must be shot down on sight.

                • JimD

                  If your comment is stupid and pedantic in relationship to the comments then i will say so.

                  You may have noted that I have en quite detailed in my explanations and comments. You have made no realistic comments.

                  There is nothing in my comments that will not work. subject to mechanical considerations mainly regarding pin positioning.

                  At least I have the decency to put my name on my comments. What about you?
                  So yes you are stupid and pedantic.

    • Paul Latouche

      If Panasonic is designing its new lenses to fit a bigger sensor format, it would be quite surprising that the new zooms (14-140 and 14-42) are by far smaller than before.
      Hence, I do think that “4/3 is the format”.

      • JimD

        Its not a bigger format. It’s just a bigger sensor that can take advantage of a wider circle, when the opportunity arises.

        • Anonymous

          And it just so happens that size of the image circle (especially the usable part with regards to distortion and sharpness) and the size of lenses is directly related and a larger image circle (which means a larger format tegardless of your refusal to understand this) results in bigger lenses, not in smaller ones.

          Given the same level of technology, the gains of switching from 4/3″ to aps-c are small, and not worth the effort, spending the money on technological improvement is more effective.

          • JimD

            I do not wonder you are anon. You are also clueless.
            What you are saying is that if I put my ultron 28mm m on a leica the image will be crap compared to using it on my em5.
            The image circle is designed to match fitting a sensor at a certain flange distance (including adapter if required). If the circle happens to be bigger than the sensor ( sigma 19mm on m43) the rest of the circle mysteriously gets corrupted or even dissapears. You need your head examined.

            • JimD

              That should read, “the rest of the circle mysteriously gets corrupted or even disappears?” Questioning your written interpretation note the ?.

            • Anonymous

              I never said the part outside the sensor magically becomes crap, but maybe you may have noticed how the center part of an image projected by a lens is better then the corners, and how lenses that provide better quality near the edges tend to be larger? Now just think about what that means for wanting to cover a larger sensor while providing decent performance in the corners…

              Conclusion, supporting a bigger sensor means your corners will be further away, and you need more ‘work’ for ensuring good corner performance.

              • JimD

                You have not visited the speedbooster group on flickr. Your argument is shot by the images there. Go have a look then quit the negativity.

                • Anonymous

                  Maybe you should try to understand shat is being said first?

                  Speedbooster is a reducer that squeezes a wider field of view into a given projection size. By being a reducer it inherently changes the focal length (and as a result the relative aperture).

                  You initially argued that panasonic may be redesigning the lenses to cover a larger image circle so they can use a larger sensor. I merely pointed out that that will make the lenses bigger.

                  Now, you first of all fail to see how your speedbooster example has nothing whatsoever to do with this, as it actually does the opposite of what you argued, and second, you also failed to understand that a 20/1.7 for 4/3″ for example will be smaller then a 20/1.7 for 135 format (if you can find such a lens to begin with) if they are to provide anywhere near the same kind of image qualiy. This is still true for example for m mount lenses and isn’t just caused by the need for retrofocal designs.

                  Oh well, seeing how you refuse to understand things that are inconvenient for what you want, fail to understand even your own arguments, and resort to name calling and insults, we can safely assume its actually you who is clueless.

                  • JimD

                    I suggest you go back and read my comments not your interpretation of them. You are throwing in a lot of things that I have not brought up.
                    I simply said that the m43 sensor could be bigger say apsc size.
                    Have you got that?
                    Use m43 mounts, flange distance and contact pin locations. There you have a standard m43 camera. Have you got that.

                    Now put on an 135/apsc lens with a standard m43 adapter. This is what is done now. Yes/No?

                    Ok here is the change. Flip a switch or push a button or set up the setup and the wider lens image can be captured. eg; a sigma 19mm. or oly m43 45mm. Just as if it is a APSC sensor (given matching electronics). So we have just made the m43 apsc sensor compatible. You still there?
                    Now fit a speed booster and using the larger sensor size it should give the same result as using the apsc speed booster, based on the fact that m43 and apsc speed boosters use the same change factor.
                    The m43 camera can become as the apsc is. Yet maintain complete m43 standards.
                    Now what is difficult to understand in that.
                    Only 2 things can stop it. The contact pins blocking a larger sensor, which I do not think they will and the speed booster is drasticly different between the apsc and m43 versions. As they are using the same lens structure an conversion it is highly likely that it will also work in the enlarged sensor state.
                    just digest that and don’t go on about it not being m43 and all the other stuff you are plucking out of the air. Others seem to understand it, you may also, if you try a bit harder and open your very rigid mind.

                    • Anonymous

                      Oh really? Here is what you said initially:

                      > Methinks we may see a new camera with a m43 mount that has a larger sensor about APSC size. and Pany is widening
                      > their image circle correspondingly on new/replacement lenses

                      So… I didn’t make that up, nor did I make up anything else.

                      >. The new sensor output will be sized according to the lens mounted or from the control panel.And don’t go on about 4/3 is the format. The sensor can be any size that fits the mechanical boundaries. Its only a measurement.

                      And format has nothing to do with measurement….

                      Oh, and logic nor facts care for who is saying what, either the logic is correct, or it isn’t. Facts can be verified or not. The messenger does not matter at all, and trying to shift attention from the message to the messenger is again a clear sign of you not having a good argument.

                  • JimD

                    Anonymous. Just for you.

                    “So… I didn’t make that up, nor did I make up anything else.” Yes. I did say that. So what!
                    This is a rumors site is it not? there is also nothing wrong with it as a statement or as a possible solution to better IQ.
                    “And format has nothing to do with measurement “ Yes I accept that ‘a format’ has a certain structure and standards. But there is a wide range of things that can be changed. Just look at the pany multi aspect sensor.
                    I have repeatedly referred to maintaining the m43 standards. You will note carefully. But it is intended that, as I said, “The sensor can be any size that fits the mechanical boundaries. Its only a measurement.” It is only a measurement meaning any measurement that fits the space available is fine either by intent (making the space bigger), or by utilising limited space available. One can call it anything. Until its been made its just a bunch of measurements that depend on other factors such as the location of the contact pins an other aspects of the m43 standard. Again the pany multi aspect sensor as reference for redefining within the rules.

                    Your comment,
                    “Oh, and logic nor facts care for who is saying what, either the logic is correct, or it isn’t. Facts can be verified or not. The messenger does not matter at all, and trying to shift attention from the message to the messenger is again a clear sign of you not having a good argument.”
                    Agree, so why not read what is written and yes pose problems, but read the answers. Follow your own doctrine.

    • rpm40

      Why bother? Sensors are getting better, not worse. Larger sensors will be needed by fewer people in the future, not more.

      • JimD

        It would shut a lot of complainers up! A metabones speedboster + an a APSC lens ( 135 lens) would be 135 equivalent, or fit a standard m43 lens, it could all work.

      • JimD

        Look at Tiziano Salvinis pix. He is using a nex6 + speedbooster and a canon 24-105 zoom (+others). makes the zoom to 135 eq and faster.
        Make the m43 sensor bigger but keep the m43 mount and M43 can use any 135, apsc or m43 lens as the designer intended. In fact better than intended. Just by utilising a slightly bigger sensor.
        http://www.flickr.com/photos/62380904@N08/with/8660248087/

        • Anonymous

          Hey jim, did you notice that 135 and aps-c refer to… the size of the medium (film/sensor), and so does 4/3. You can slap another mount on it but that doesn’t change the format.

          • JimD

            What does ‘format’ mean in this era of upsize and downsize?
            The only constant we have at present is 3.2 4.3 The 135 sensor and then millions of smaller sizes. Even APSC is not APSc.
            So m43 can be any size as long as it keeps the mount and flange distance as they are the real guts of the ‘format’. The 4 x 3 ratio is is nice but we can get 1.1 3.2 and 16.9 from an oly 4/3 sensor so why not apsc from a m43 mount when an over size sensor is used and told to use more sensor than m43 native.
            As long as the mechanicals work. So will any format around them.

            • Anonymous

              First of all you are confusing format and aspect ratio, while a format MAY define an aspect ratio, it doesn’t have to. So 4:3 and 3:2 etc might be defined by a format, but they do not define a format.

              A format does however define a minimum size for the image circle, either explicitly or implicitly, and as a consequence also define the maximum size of the medium.

              If this wasn’t the case, you’d have to check for each lens what image circle it covers and if that is large enough to cover the sensor in your device,, eventho it claims to be a micro fourthirds or ef-s or dx format lens. Lets not even get to buying a new camera and having to check if its sensor is covered by all the lenses you own.

              And indeed, aps-c is merely a group of formats that is close in size, proper names would be Nikon DX or Canon EF-S for example.

              You can technically put a larger sensor behind a mft mount, but the resulting camerav won’t be a mft camera.

              • JimD

                The format is defined by the aspect. Go look at the wonderful list of formats in wikiland . My Bronica GS is 6×7 or 6×6 or 6×4.5 format in the medium format range It can also be 35mm if I use that in one of the cassettes. The standard for m43 is defined by the measurements and electronics contact designations and control properties.
                As for being 4/3 format, because of a million year old valve that’s crap’ it might as well have been called TV format, its a lot closer to home.
                If it has a m43 mount uses m43 flange distance and pin contact assignments correctly (or even no pins) Then the size of the sensor is is ony relative to the angle of view from the lens.
                You say,
                “if this wasn’t the case, you’d have to check for each lens what image circle it covers and if that is large enough to cover the sensor in your device,, eventho it claims to be a micro fourthirds or ef-s or dx format lens. Lets not even get to buying a new camera and having to check if its sensor is covered by all the lenses you own”
                I say nonsense this is covered by the standard. m43 lenses to be used in native form. m43 lenses derived from apsc with m43 mount or m43 speedbooster, then flick the switch and get a larger sensor area.
                Simple. Do not try to make simple things difficult. That’s for politicians.

                • Anonymous

                  You mean like this for example?

                  “The Nikon DX format is an alternative name used by Nikon corporation for APS-C image sensor format being approximately 24×16 mm.”

                  from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nikon_DX_format

                  Oh hey, it defines the size of the medium, and by extension also the aspect ratio.

                  But hey, looks like you don’t understand the difference between various image formats (which is what you are referring to) and various formats for image capturing media (which is what things like 135, 120, 4/3 etc are referring to).

                  Never mind, all this is just pedantic in your view. Why would we stick any meaning to words at all anyway.

                  I only wonder about one thing, is ‘speedbooster’ a new religion or what? The way you try to cut down anything that seems to stand in the way of your pipe dream, regardless of what it is, quite gives the impression of religious fundamentalism. Anyone who doesn’t agree with your dream just doesn’t ‘see the light’ obviously.

                  • JimD

                    Pedantic! look at what you have written “being approximately 24×16 mm.” That’s all soft and fuzzy. In reality it is to ensure it fits within a standard image circle, I am sure that it allows several aspect to be used as well. Words that mean it may be so, but also may not be so. The m43 standard among other things, defines the sensor yet Pany made it a custom sensor by making it wider, yes within the defined image circle but not written in the standard.

                    Also note that the same article says “DX format is very similar in size to sensors from Pentax, Sony and other camera manufacturers” there is no standard being use for the term APSC. All are referred to as APS-C including the slightly smaller Canon cameras.”
                    That is where the brand standard is applied. It defines the sensor size, mound flange distance, contact points, electrical properties and other items . It may be loosely refereed to as an apsc. But apsc is a standard on its own (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/APS-C) that no one uses. They use the term apsc because that is near enough for their chosen sensor size, that’s why they are all very, very different.
                    Format is today a loose and sloppy uses of the word format. Today it all boils down to a standard for this camera and a standard for that camera, and its compatible addons.

                    120 film is a standard it is not a format as it can have several formats (aspect ratio if you wish) within its standard. 135 film is a standard it also can have several formats within its standard. (change the sprocket holes and its a different standard)
                    The standard is what counts and that defines more than a sensor or aspect, in to days terms the m43 standard is just referred to by most as m43, meaning the lens mount, sensor size and aspect. No one but a 3rd party addon creator is interested in the rest of the standard.

                    Perhaps you should send your comments to the ones who called it the m43 format and not the m43 standard as it should be called.

  • ginsbu

    Since the current 20mm pancake is a unit focusing design, faster AF probably requires moving to an internal focusing group (as in the 14mm pancake) with changes to the optical design to accommodate that. Hopefully Panasonic can accomplish this without detracting from the good optical qualities of the current lens.

  • Matt

    The only thing Panasonic need to do to sell a lot more of this lens is to fix its problems, which caused many people to resist or buy alternatives.

    – Banding
    – Noisy and slow AF

    It would also help if it can get rid of the cheap colors, the too loud red dot and the funny silver on the lens barrel.

    • BEATS BEING SILVER ALL DAY

      First, it’s the AF, now it’s the color. What’s next, no lens hood?

    • Pharque Moi

      Will the new one be purple like the other new lenses?

  • Henrik

    More better will certainly be much more expensive. It was a good option within the m43 market.

    I wonder if something new comes that brings quality and creative options with the same aperture and bokeh for the money. I can’t see Pana bringing out a lens that’s a no-brainer.

  • Fish

    Great news.

  • Yun

    This intend a very very nice lens I ever owned .
    Go ahead with mark 2 . Speed up the motor inside & optic slightly better & it will sell like a hot cake .
    I wonder if it will be Leica branded lens ?

  • adaptor-or-die

    no one speculates it will simply be a cosmetic update? The guts probably will remain the same, just get a new colour/texture/material skin, a metal tube? The rampant optimism of advancement is encouraging, but then I guess wait for the flood of complaints when the new version simply some stylist rebranding ..

    • napilopez

      The thing is that panasonic, unlike olympus, doesn’t tend to just update it’s lenses cosmetically. As far as I can recall, every remake of a lens they’ve done has involved new optics or slight spec modifications.

      At the very least, they will probably resolve the banding issue with the GH3 and newer olys.

      • OMega

        Seeing as you have already mentioned the banding problem, which now also affects the GH3 (so I guess we can expect that to happen with all new bodies with updated sensors). So for me the very least has to be a complete redesign of the lens, while Panasonic states it’s a sensor issue, it’s strange that no other lenses (to my knowledge) produce this problem.

  • Anonymous

    AF!

  • Ben

    It would be great if it comes as GX2 kit lens!

  • Anonymous

    maybe 17.5mm/1.2 or 1.4

    Don’t forget Pana doesn’t have 35mm lens yet (17.5 * 2)

    I am waiting for this!!!

    • there are already 2x 17mm lenses
      Pan offers alternative 14/20/25 to Oly 12/17/17/45
      (ignoring macro and fisheye)
      so it would be dumb to have a Pan17

      while Pan/Oly don’t really appear to be talking to each other at least they are not repeating prime fiscal lengths. prime are gonna be much lower volume than zoom sales.

      Gosh is the Pan 14 really there newest prime! hurry up already (perhaps the announced ones will launch with the GX7)

      • Anonymous

        dumb???

        both 17mm right now are from Olympus company

        even these 2 company join the same system but they are rival too.

        oh.. please think about how many versions of the 14-42 kit lenses from both companies. : )

  • tomas

    I hope/think they would keep it 20mm …for 17,5 there are already lenses available

  • Boris

    Just improve the AF, please!
    I’ve got both 14mm F2.5 and 20mm F1.7; while the 20mm F1.7 is the “faster” lens, its focus speed isn’t the faster one…
    The annoying motor noise and focus hunting are probably the greatest flaws of this lens; the optics are fine though.

  • Anonymous

    I bet the new version will cost 400-500 and it won’t be optically better than a discounted 100$ Sigma 19mm.

    Let the starry eyed Panny fanpersons go to the bak with a smile…

  • Narretz

    What I expect from the successor:

    – faster, near-silent, internal auto-focus
    – same max aperture, and obviously focal length
    – same size, same build quality
    – same optical quality / improvements nearly undetectable for the eye
    – same price (Pana needs it as an evergreen, can’t make it too expensive)
    – no weather-sealing (as the de-facto allround prime, it would drive the price too high)
    – no IBIS (Pana doesn’t put OIS in primes, and now that the GX7 has IBIS, it’s even more unlikely)
    – kit lens for GX7

    Speaking of kit lenses, it looks like there will be either no zoom kit, or only the 14-42 MkII. Since Admin said there will be no completely new lenses in 2013. But then again, Pana kept its new lenses much better under wraps then its cameras, except when they want to show them.

    • alvarelias

      + nano coating ;)

  • alfastar

    I knew it, I knew it, I knew it! hooray hooray hooray. My next purchase will be the GX7+the new 20mm kit!

  • Anonymous

    Admin! A Survey!

    How we would like the 20mm Mk2 with respect to some dimensions (cheaper, more compact, faster AF, faster exp., better build, less noise, etc)

  • Andy

    Improved anti reflection coatings would be welcome too, as well as faster AF. Contrast is a bit low compared to the 25mm 1.4 with its “nano” coatings.

  • Anonymous

    Overdue redesign. Fast AF and its a winner.
    Hopefully it will not make it much larger.

  • Salty

    If they made this lens internal focussing like the 14mm, how much effort would it be to weatherseal it? It’s small, it’s got no zoom ring, no buttons. Would seem to be relatively easy. Love a fast weathersealed ‘normal’ prime.

    Then I can sell my 12-50mm…

  • awaler

    Optical quality and size, at the price asked, gave this lens the best price/performance ratio in the m43 world.
    In terms of numbers produced, it must have been a top runner.
    I am looking forward to the successor.
    Every little bit of improvement in AF speed and noise will be appreciated.

  • derek

    I think they cannot make it any better than this, this Pana 20mm/1.7 is already almost perfect.

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