More Nikon versus Micro Four Thirds articles!
Cnet Asia (Click here) wrote a first take test about the new Nikon 1 V1 and clearly said that it cannot compete against m43: “The company tells us it aims to target entry-level users with the introduction of the J1 and V1. But we wonder if compact upgraders will choose Nikon over other brands such as Panasonic’s feature-rich Lumix series and Sony’s NEX series with their larger APS-C sensors. In an already crowded ILC segment, Nikon will need a clear marketing strategy in order to reach out to shutterbugs. ” You can see an image quality comparison on their Website.
Laurence Kim (Click here) says the Nikon is an epic fail: “My guess is that 5 years from now, Nikon’s lineup will not equal what m4/3 has available today.”
Image Quality comparison at EosHD (Click here). It includes a G3 vs V1 comparison.
Nikon V1 vs Olympus PEN E-P3 vs Sony NEX-7 at Techradar (Click here): “The Olympus PEN E-P3, at the moment, seems to offer the best compromise. It has neither the biggest or smallest sensor, offers a decent range of lenses, has nifty features such as the touchscreen and comes in at the best price.”
I repeat once again, I am certainly not a fanboy when I am say I do not like the new Nikon’s. Will it sell well? The new Sony NEX cameras made it into the top twenty of the Amazon Bestseller (or preorder) ranking (Click here to read the list). Just to say that it’s not just me and the reviewers being bad to Nikon 
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Recent comments
Comment from Den: It's me. Not price wise though. I take p...
Comment from Jim: By the way people do we relize how mega ...- Comment from Jim: yep +1 ... the G3 + GH2 are total diffre...
Comment from Dummy00001: BTW, from the review, wrt AF: "In the...
amalric
8 months ago |IMHO it doesn’t make sense below a certain size of sensor to invest in multiple lenses.
Other than brand recognition it is difficult to imagine why the Japanese consumers would invest in such a Nikon device, or in the Pentax one.
They might have a temporary success, but then why spend the same to have an inferior IQ.
BTW, the Nex 7 mihgt have changed the ratings temporarily, but Sony was behind m4/3 after a short success in BCN rankings.
So I suppose buyers are not totally blind to the IQ/size of what they are buying,
AutoMan
8 months ago |So why do people buy m4/3 at all, it is inferior IQ with it’s smaller sensor vs aps-c or FF? Why do they buy the nex? Why bother with FF when there is MF.
M4/3 users are eager to find someone to pick on as they were the runt of the litter vs aps-c until nikon came with an ILC compact camera. Oh boy does m4/3 look good now we can point our fingers to someone else finally.
mooboy
8 months ago |Totally agree.
It’s interesting Pentax Q has been a top seller in Japan, but clearly wouldn’t appeal to most on these forums. So, will be interesting to see how the Nikon 1 goes commercially.
napalm
8 months ago |nah… it’s more of m4/3 using the same argument that has been thrown unto them for years… sensor size. now that Nikon chose to be smaller, m4/3 people are now saying “I thought smaller was worse?” but now Nikon people are saying it will kill m4/3 hehehe
Jim
8 months ago |To be honist I reckon the Nikon J1 has better Hi ISO performance then the EP1/GF3… 3200 + 6400 are noticably more under control… ok the lens seems poor and has no shrpness at lower ISOs but blow for blow in the night I reckon the J1 will hold its own with m43!
Agent00soul
8 months ago |Have you looked at the 3200 iso samples at EosHD? The G3 totally creams the Nikon. There is simply no contest.
Frederic Hew
8 months ago |That was not my analysis of the high ISO samples on EosHD.
IMO the Nikon was more or less on on the same level with the G3 (detail retention in high ISO), and the E-P3 was way behind.
Then again, those are OOC JPGs with the camera default noise reduction, I’d like to see processed RAW files.
(Note that Jim is comparing the Nikon to the old 12MP Panasonic sensor)
Jim
8 months ago |yep +1 … the G3 + GH2 are total diffrent to any other m43 cam (sensor quality wize) but on the whole the “old” sensor is the main use sensor for m43… and the J1 is whipping it for higher ISOs!
Bob B.
8 months ago |This is a dead issue. We should just drop it.
I don’t know who NIkon’s Mirrorless market is …but it definitely isn’t us.
io
8 months ago |+1
It makes non sense to talk about Nikon system again.
Thom Hogan
8 months ago |+1/2
Den
7 months ago |It’s me. Not price wise though. I take photos of my kids so fast focus and those new features would help.
MikeH
8 months ago |It is obvious who the market is for these cameras…
People who want interchangable lens cameras that have smaller sensors than their competitors with lower IQ, DOF limitations, and yet are as physically large and heavier than the rest. They also want 1238417484 point focus and no manual controls.
The J1 is a heap of crap. The V1 I suppose I could see someone buying as a bridge camera with one or two kit zooms but that same buyer isn’t going to go for a ton of glass after the initial purchase.
WT21
8 months ago |+1!
I clicked in just to ask if we could stop the Nikon posts, as they are really irrelevant. Maybe have a poll “do you want to hear more about Nikon mirrorless?”
I vote no. Thanks Bob B. for posting first!
Bob B.
8 months ago |+10
(great camera NIkon..have fun with that….just not here)
M43Photo
8 months ago |I think Nikon has a pretty good case with the cameras. In a way, it’s what “we” want: A sensor small enough to make compact cameras and lenses, but large enough for good IQ and selective focus, an adapter that allows you to use “legacy” AF-S lenses. Add to that a solid brand name, and they might have a winner?
In addition, they are dropping out of the megapixel race by launching cameras with 10MP. In 2011! That’s pretty amazing. And it’s what enthusiasts want: A sensible amount of megapixels rather than cramming the highest number possible into the sensor. I think even the Panasonic designers said that the GH2 shouldn’t have had 16MP, but they had to accommodate the marked demands.
Now, for the lenses: They are too large. Their superzoom lens (10-100mm) has a larger filter thread diameter than the Panasonic G HD 14-140mm, that’s a fail right there.
Talking Tree
8 months ago |I sold all my Nikon equipment almost two years ago and made the switch to Micro 4/3ds! I’m sure glad I did because Nikon is becoming a complete FLOP! hahaha… They used to be the legend of the camera world. Nikon, join the micro 4/3ds standard and get a some of the real booty!
David Irisarri Vila
8 months ago |Well, I still think the microfourthirds is the way to go but I am pretty sure NIKON has got a sensor with no bayer pattern and this will increase effective resolution within an inch sensor. By the way, we have seen microfourthirds lenses are incredibly compact but also the bodies and there is a minimum size for a serious mirrorless camera so…What can I say? I am pretty amazed how Olympus was able to choose the right sensor size for a really compact and lightweight system nine years ago! Kudos Olympus! The OM-SYSTEM legacy continues.
Tiago
8 months ago |Why has Nikon’s sensor no bayer pattern?
David Irisarri Vila
8 months ago |Nikon wanted to create something even smaller than 4/3 but resolution never can be higher unless they use a sensor without bayer pattern. Foveon/Sigma has its own patent, Panasonic has another different system and I am pretty sure Nikon does. It´s a matter of time they start releasing cameras with them. Then Nikon System can be an advantage using this smaller sensor, the only problem is noise and dynamic range.
David
Pekka Potka
8 months ago |The sensor in these Nikon bodies HAS Bayer filter in front of sensor.
-p-
devorama
8 months ago |The Cnet article is flawed. The comparison picture of GF3 vs. J1 vs. V1 is not scaling all 3 cameras equally. Notice the same lens on the J1 and V1 are different sizes!
Dummy00001
8 months ago |http://www.focus-numerique.com/test-1302/compact-nikon-v1-bruit-electronique-12.html
Detail retention is pretty good. Colors are good too. When compared to E-P3. Sad reality of Oly’s out-dated sensor tech.
twoomy
8 months ago |I *AM* a Nikon fanboi, but I don’t like the new V1/J1 one bit. I’ve been shooting with the Panasonic GH2 for a year now and I haven’t looked back. So much lovely glass for M43 these days; it’s a great system that hits the sweet spot perfectly. Maybe I’ve become a M43 fanboi!!!
Bob
8 months ago |The biggest request from families looking for cameras is the ability to focus quickly and not have shutter lag. If these cameras can shoot children running around and get video as well, then yes Nikon indeed has a winner. I know many people who bought dslrs and be super disappointed because They’re videos were all out of focus. They were using a 5D because they heard it had the best video. Nikons marketing should be towards young families.
YouDidntDidYou
8 months ago |@Bob
Pens and Lumix have the”ability to focus quickly and not have shutter lag. If these cameras can shoot children running around and get video as well, ” just switch it over to the iauto modes – maybe Oly and Panny have to market this feature more effectively…
Dummy00001
8 months ago |It’s not about shutter lag – it is about AF speed/continuous AF tracking abilities.
As soon as m43 gets the capacity, it would also become capable of shooting sports – the requirements are the same. Yes, shooting *kids* is that complicated.
But hey, let’s wait for V1/J1 reviews. Probably Nikon AF claims are vaporware.
YouDidntDidYou
8 months ago |for it’s targeted market it’s a fail
- no social media upload function (they’ll just stick with or upgrade their smart phones)
- another lens mount (people are sick to death of propriety systems)
- too high a price compared to those “fire sale” Olympus Pens (now we know why Thom Hogan been been bitching about Olympus for the last few months)
- not an attractive design for it’s target market
- no touch screen
- pretty sure it will have poor battery life which won’t impress it’s target market
SteveD
8 months ago |The top 100 list from Amazon has a sparse attendance of mu43 cameras.
Joel
8 months ago |The whole discussion is sort of irrelevant, the 1 series say ‘nikon’ on them so will outsell u4/3 in multiple orders of magnitude regardless of their practicalities.
Nick Clark
8 months ago |I wouldn’t be so sure… After all, people once said similar things about Kodak/Ford/IBM/etc etc…
Joel Eisner
8 months ago |I hope your right but Canon/Nikon still have a lot of brand recognition, at least at the moment..
Anonymous
8 months ago |Yeah right, just like P7000 outselling XZ1, is it?
Joel Eisner
8 months ago |exactly… can you show me sales figures where the XZ1 outsells the P7000??? Here (OZ) the P7000 is more widely available and outsells the XZ1, despite the XZ1 being a better camera IMHO..
Joel Eisner
8 months ago |Besides they are different markets, people think more about the brand when buying into a system than buying a throw away P&S (I call it throw away as you can’t keep upgrading parts of it like a system)..
For example some of the larger retail chains here don’t even bother stocking the Pen cameras (or much of them).. Not that I agree with that, but it is the case, I will bet they will stock the Nikon 1..
Just have to wait and see… Whilst I agree with what everyone is saying about u4/3 being a far better system, I just don’t think the sales will end up in our favour..
Baron
8 months ago |These new Nikon formats doesn’t make sense for the following reasons:
1) Despite having smaller sensors, there is no apparent size advantage over m43.
2) Extremely different crop factor between the Nikon V1/J1 and Nikon SLRs will mean it won’t make sense to adaptor SLR lenses to the V1/J1. And lens selection for V1/J1 will be lmited for some time.
3) 2.7x crop means DOF control is limited.
I am intrigued by the 60fps on the Nikon though. But that takes away the fun of photography.
dk
8 months ago |Nikon’s move is sensible – 3 sensor sizes. Their small sensor is for small cameras. Canon appears ready to do the same. 4/3 should have done the likewise. 4/3 will never be able to compete directly with the large sensors, probably not even the medium sensor sizes, offered by Nikon and Canon. Other manufacturers will follow suit in years to come. By “putting all their 4/3 eggs” in one size “basket,’ Olympus and Panasonic are doomed in the professional arena.
Frederic Hew
8 months ago |I don’t see what m43, Nikon System 1 or NEX have to do with the professional arena.
Do you think this technology is mature enough for working pros to rely on? Do you think it is intended to replace professional cameras eventually? I don’t.
I think Nikon’s and Pentax’ move does, in fact, create a niche for m43: smaller than APS-C DSLRs and bigger than other CSCs.
Sony and Samsung, if they prove successful, are the ones that pose a direct threat on m43 because they are trying to show you can have a larger sensor on a small interchangeable lens camera.
Nick Clark
8 months ago |I’m fascinated by the number of blogs/websites that are suddenly saying that M43 is ‘just right’…
Of course, we knew that all along
YouDidntDidYou
8 months ago |@Nick Clark
yeah it’s cool that it’s just dawned on so many blogs/websites we wore them down lol
YouDidntDidYou
8 months ago |@ admin
have you seen this?
http://www.photographyblog.com/news/redrock_micro_livelens_mft/
Dummy00001
8 months ago |C|Net posted their J1′s review:
http://reviews.cnet.com/digital-cameras/nikon-1-j1-with/4505-6501_7-35020091.html
Conclusion: “The Nikon 1 J1 is a fine camera, but there’s nothing here that screams out “buy it” over similar competitors. It’s also on the expensive side for a point-and-shoot upgrader, but has drawbacks for the more advanced user.”
Dummy00001
8 months ago |BTW, from the review, wrt AF:
“In the complete auto AF, it selects the focus points quickly, but inconsistently; for any given scene, it will choose different sets of points each time you prefocus.”
So no miracle has happened, move on people.
ljmac
8 months ago |Admin: why haven’t you linked to the image samples from the J1 on Imaging Resource? This is the first controlled set of samples from these cameras across all ISOs that can be directly compared to images from other cameras. If you do this, you will find the Nikon is a blurry mess at base ISO – the EP3 is far sharper and more detailed, far greater than the difference between 10MP and 12MP would suggest (try an old 10MP 4/3rds camera for comparison if you like). Clearly the Nikons are swimming in noise reduction to keep them clean enough (like a compact), and the optics look awfully soft too (high end compacts are sharper).
Oh – and the base ISO of the EP3 is twice as high too (200 vs. 100). Of course, the J1 looks even worse at ISO 200.
WT21
8 months ago |To some extent, the Nikon’s have actually reinforced what m43 is all about. When it was mainly NEX vs. m43, it was sensor-size, sensor-size, sensor-size. With the Nikon, m43 ends up looking like the little bear’s stuff in Goldilocks (i.e. “just right”).
ljmac
8 months ago |I agree. The 1 system may be the best thing that ever happened to 4/3rds, especially if they incorporate similar phase detect AF technology for old 4/3rds lenses.
I actually thought the 1″ sensor might be the sweet spot myself, but the new Panny X 14-42 and the size of the 1 system lenses (plus their compact camera level IQ) have led me to believe that 4/3rds really is the best compromise after all.
Nick Clark
8 months ago |I think your last point is the key to this whole thing…
The Pany X 14-42 was precisely the right lens at precisely the right time, and with decent marketting leaves the Nikon 1 system with essentially no reason to exist.
Wkk
8 months ago |The V1 and J1 may be the next Pronea but on the other hand they will sit on the shelves next to the Nikon DSLRs taking up shelf space that should rightfully belong to Pen bodies.
Pekka Potka
8 months ago |I have never seen such a smile on some industry insiders´ face while discussing about a competitor´s camera as now…
-p-
kesztió
8 months ago |The G3 vs. V1 comparison is simply astonishing.
But J1 and V1 still have 5 very strong – and very visible! – arguments against Oly/Pana:
The ‘N’, the ‘i’, the ‘k’, the ‘o and the ‘n’.
Anonymous
8 months ago |this is a “big blunder ” for Nikon ,..it seems like they had no clue with what they are doing ,.. poor nikon being drifting by the trend market.
anyway ,I want to see the video review from DIGITALREV Mr KAI talk about this system
Anonymous
8 months ago |IF CANON WOULD JOINT M4/3,…it could be a biggest mistake for nikon having their own mirror less system,..checkmate
lorenzino
8 months ago |And this hypothesis comes from … ?
Same would be “if Leica joins m43…, or if Sony joins m43…”
But guess what, not going to happen.
In chess you do not imagine situations like “if I had a queen in seventh then I would win easily”. Yes, danke, we know, but you do not have a queen in seventh so you will have to invent other strategies to win.
So, in m43 vs nikon 1 there is no checkmate yet, not even a check. Just an apparently wrong move on Nikon part, which, in a chess game, may even conceal a genial one. WHo knows…
Buel
8 months ago |I think it’s still to early to say Nikon fails. Actually, I’m looking for a cam for my wife for Christmas. It has to be small enough to fit into her handbag. Fast AF is a must have to get the shots of our children. 10 MP is enough. A kit lens + a tele lens should be available. Problem with the Nikon is that the price is too high (at the moment) and that the lenses are quiet slow. On the other hand the m43 zooms are slow too. A prime is no option. Of course I will have a look at the Nikon 1, as well as at the Canon S100. The decision will be made out of size, price, are the lenses available she wants, AF, and of course IQ. IQ is important, but it’s not important if you can get clean 3200 iso shots for super large prints. The only thing I know for the moment: we never will have a pink camera in our house.
This whole site is a bit too negative about the Nikon – well maybe this is to be expected, it’s a website about 43.
Jim
8 months ago |By the way people do we relize how mega 60fps @ full res is!
We are talking about a camera that (maybe only for a buffer time of a few sec) can record 4K video at 60fps!!!! that is up there with the best RED camera!!!
AMAZING!