And again new tidbits about the Polaroid iM1836. Would you buy it?
The Polaroid iM1836 is the first non-Panasonic and non- Olympus camera that will also be compatible with MFT lenses. And here are some more facts about the camera:
1) The US company Sakar actually makes the camera. It borrowed the Polaroid name and (although not official) it also seems to have borrowed the Nikon J1 design.
2) The camera is modular. It means it has no sensor built into the camera itself. It’s built into the lens in case of the original Polaroid lenses (with 1 inch sensor). And while they didn’t say much about it I suspect there will be a MFT adapter with built-in sensor. You should be able to use all MFT lenses attached on that adapter.
3) Just to avoid any mistake. There is also a second model called “iM1030″ that doesn’t run Android OS (while the iM1836 is based on Android).
4) There is no production version of the camera yet and price will be close to $400.
All in all this is an attempt to build an “universal camera” a la Ricoh GXR. A camera with support for all possible system lenses and based on an open source platform. Will it work out? My answer is …no 
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atlasman
5 months ago |Admin,
I would like to see you ask if m4/3 compatible full frame from Olympus would be please your audience.
Tim
5 months ago |Woulnt that be impossible. Unless you make one with a new lens system that makes full use of the bigger sensor. And lets you use m43 glass on half of that sensor? I was told that m4/3 glass cant cover a full frame sensor without “vignetting” half of the sensor dark.
MarcoSartoriPhoto
5 months ago |Exactly. You can use old legacy lenses on a NEX for example, and the vignetting is awfull. Same thing if you try to cover a 135mm sensor with a m4/3 mount. So you would need a new set of specific lenses, something too expensive to plan, in my opinion. Btw, every sensor is a full frame sensor.
ningning
5 months ago |Anyone who knows anything knows it would be pointless. You would end up with insane amounts of cropping no matter how you engineered such a beast.
Personally I would like to own a FF and an MFT, am investing in MFT system now and will eventually buy into a FF system. At this stage most likely Leica.
Edward
5 months ago |Hi, I am at CES.
I spoke with Polaroid yesterday and again today about the Android camera. As noted, the sensor is inside the kit lens and not in the camera body. The reason they did this is because in their research, the low end interchangeable lens camera buyer is, well, sort of clueless. Its a different buyer than us that they are after – these are people moving up to a DSLR like camera but have no real idea how to use it or handle it. And in this group, they found new users storing their camera body without a lens attached, leaving dust and debris – even damaging the sensors. That’s their argument.
The micro four thirds adapter will have a sensor built in to the adapter and, when placed on the camera body, will then work with all m43 lenses. This adapter will probably be available in April – no price yet provided but was told that it will be surprisingly affordable.
This is not the only adapter they will be making. They expect to offer adapters for other lens lines as well and the second one might be out this spring too.
Edward
I have photos for various things from CES on my blog at 3d.coldstreams.com. More stuff should get uploaded late this evening, Las Vegas time.
Tim
5 months ago |If you could stick a m43 with that adapter on a printer camera a la poloroid z340 ,with a better resolution print and sensor m4/3 omd quality. Would it be much more interesting?
Bob
5 months ago |We already have the goods. Why would we need a Polaroid camera body that is less than what we have available to us now?
I love MFT, the bodies and the lenses. It’s all good. All we need is to keep the system growing and have steady improvements in the sensors.
I know that this Polaroid camera expands the system, in a way…but it is nothing that I would buy.
Edward
5 months ago |Many vendors are offering cameras that redefine our concept of the camera. Take a look at the Canon Powershot N, for example.
Nikon, Polaroid and Samsung have all introduced Android-based cameras. These are a new type of camera, with possibility also of 3rd party app support adding new capabilities to these platforms.
The Polaroid model is not just another m43 type camera. Its an Android user interface, can support future photo applications, provides image sharing directly (what a LOT of people want to do today), and with their adapter concept, can support many different lens systems. It’s also a very small camera (many of us like small, as do many consumers).
This camera is aimed at the person what wants a real camera, but is knew to using advanced cameras, and who wants to share images. By potentially supporting many lens adapters, it will – almost out of the box – have a large compliment of available lenses depending on which adapters are made and when they come to market.
I’ve seen the camera first hand. Its a very intriguing idea and will be interesting to see how the market reacts to it. Polaroid is keen on retaining its heritage of simple camera technology – think back to the early instant film camera. Press button, roll it out and watch it develop.
EdwardM
SonyCyberPunk
5 months ago |One is licensed form nikon, the other from pentax. If its cheap as heck, id buy it, if its comparable in price, fuck no.
whyzor
5 months ago |So basically this camera runs the software only, with the sensor & lens hardware separate. It could provide much needed boost in user friendliness of camera UI (User Interfaces). Most of us photographers have been used to how clunky they have been for years, Olympus for example burrying menu items in multiple layers with non-intuitive names such as S1, S2, S3…etc. Which they sell as a feature in more expensive cameras with direct access via hardware dials. In the ideal camera, the hardware will be reduced to save costs, but the interactions will be easier & faster, via touchscreens and more intuitive layouts. I think it’s promising, if not at least give the old OEM’s a kick in the behind.
MarcoSartoriPhoto
5 months ago |And no, I won’t buy this camera for sure, since a) it’s not (to me) an upgrade from my OMD, b) I don’t need it
Guest
5 months ago |Admin, slight error in your point 1). Sakar is an official Polaroid licensee. It didn’t borrow the Polaroid name.
awaler
5 months ago |Polaroid IM1836 = Solution looking for problem
adaptor-or-die
5 months ago |the photos of the camera still do not make sense? They clearly show a lens with a rear element and a sensor in the body? It can’t match up to what is described … this announcement seems to be about as rumor-laden as it gets?
AlexTR
5 months ago |In numerous previews (and in this video also) it’s clearly seen that instead of real lens element you could see some mirror-like surface (or probably simply metal shining surface). Here we have two possibilities:
1. It’s a thing that cannot be retracted after mounting (most probable) as it’s very close to the surface and I cannot see any signs of this thing could be moved. In this case sensor is clearly inside the lens, as the camera shows live video feed with mounted lens in this video
2. This thing can be retracted after mounting the lens (so it’s a protective cap or probably even leaf shutter itself – I know, it’s crazy and doesn’t look even close to it, but anyways). Also an option but looks less probable based on it looks
Another thing to mention is the number of contacts on the lens mount – it’s huge, so it’s clearly designed to handle more data echange then other lens mounts do.
And of course we have small black window in the lens mount of the body – and it looks like the sensor opening. Again two ideas here:
) sensor solution, not even necessary optical.
1. It’s some kind of ‘default’ sensor for cheap manual lenses which could be planned for this body. So you could have two sensors max simultaneously on the body (in case if ‘smart’ lenses are used), but of course it’s disabled then ‘smart’ lenses are mounted
2. It’s some kind of aux. (or even leftower prototyping hole in the body
DailyFilmFix
5 months ago |I shoot documentaries and local TV commercials with two GH1s (hacked), an HMC150 (mainly for sound), and I picked up the LX7 on Black Friday. My favorite lens is the Zuiko 45mm. Missing from my setup is wifi. This might be a neat little addition if it shoots 1080/60p video for longer than 29 minutes. It could be a good UStream cam as well, if there was a corresponding app. The key here is to make it dirt cheap so that we can get it for kicks and find a home for it in our gear bag. I could see it as a crash cam or other risky use, because the sensor is bigger than the GoPro, which really suffers in low light for concert and club use.
Physica
5 months ago |My answer is NO , but just because I don’t want to buy a product (or system) which is newly introduced. It maybe good , but It maybe risky also…… so I will leave an eye and see….
iznothere
5 months ago |I would buy another m43 mount body if it offered something unique…
- Foveon sensor
- Monochrome
- Fujifilm X-Trans CMOS sensor
lorenzino
5 months ago |In fact I was thinking the same: I have no problems with the idea of buying a m43 (well, sort of) camera from another producer. Point is: why this camera? What does it add we don’t already get from Panoly?
It all lies in the sensor they will implement in the adaptor (if the story is actually true). If the sensor is excellent, better than omd5 (or epl5), the camera works well (including UI), all legacy lenses work with no problems, and the price is right, then the whole thing could be interesting. But if, as I suspect, the IQ is not better, the price (body + adapter) is higher than the cheapest m43 offerings from Panoly, then the entire operation is moot.
Or they may offer different kind of adapters, with good monochrome, IR, foveon-like, etc. etc. sensors.
But, seriously: have you ever seen a blue turtle?
Edward
5 months ago |Polaroid is not specifically targeting those of us who know what Bayer pattern means, or what a Foveon sensor is.
We are not their target customer. I do not think they are trying to sell it against a Lumix m43 camera or an Olympus m43 camera. Their target is a customer moving up from the point and shoot or the cellphone – wanting a better camera and sharing capabilities. Wanting to consider having more than one lens.
That said, there might be some ideas in the camera that do appeal to those outside their target customer for this camera. Some of that will depend on the sensor quality, the video quality and other aspects. But I don’t think Polaroid is going to try and compete on a specifications check off list against a bunch of the cameras that interest us – GH-2/3, Olympus’s new cameras and so on.
Also, to correct something way up above – I don’t think the use of m43 lenses will result in cropping or vignetting problems. Their adapter (with built in sensor) is designed specifically to support the m43 lenses. They will likely do that well.
Ed
pizza4D
5 months ago |The camera in the hands-on video seems to actually be the iM1030.
Izhar
5 months ago |I would love to use the Polaroid camera with some CCTV C-Mount lenses.
Miroslav
5 months ago |I don’t see the reason for all the negativity…
IF this m4/3 adapter has that Sony 16Mpx sensor, IF the camera has AF at least at the E-PL1 level, IF the adapter is sensibly priced, then why not? Android can offer creative possibilities that no m4/3 body has at the moment. If Panasonic and Olympus don’t care to put in focus peaking for example, than someone could write an app. I hope Polaroid will offer advanced models as well, with EVF and articulated screen for example.
If m4/3 module has 1″ sensor as DPreview says, then it’ll be a fail from the start.
“1) it also seems to have borrowed the Nikon J1 design.”
Nikon J1 has borrowed its design from a soap, it has no design
. If iM1836 looked like V2 ( and thankfully it doesn’t ), than you could say it borrowed something from Nikon. In the same way you could say that most new smartphones have borrowed their design from the original iPhone.
“Will it work out? My answer is …no”
I have to agree on this with you. I don’t have high hopes, but I won’t put Polaroid down until I see the specs and reviews of that m4/3 module.
Esa Tuunanen
5 months ago |> Android can offer creative possibilities
Like chance of camera getting malware just like computers and smarter than their user phones…
Software cannot do what hardware is incapable to doing, like making whole camera water proof for not needing to worry about when working near water.
Miroslav
5 months ago |Phone malware is mostly vaporware. I’ve had smartphones with various OSes since 2005 and have never encountered any malicious software. In fact, I personally don’t know anyone who has.
You cannot underestimate how good software can improve existing hardware. Unfortunately, your countrymen in Nokia have and see where has that kind of thinking brought them
.
On the other hand, recent addition of time lapse video via app on new NEX cameras is a positive example.
bernard
5 months ago |This system associates in one piece a lens (with a very long life, expensive) and the sensor (with a very short life).
More, if a new sensor appears (each two years) it will need higher bandwith, higher CPU power… and a new body. Obviously a new lens. !!
To day, I get a new body (e-pl5) without any lens…
I am also waiting for the successor of the “E-5″ to operate my (marvelous) Zuiko 12-60mm and 50-200mm..
Dummy00001
5 months ago |> All in all this is an attempt to build an “universal camera” a la Ricoh GXR.
A goal, worth pursuing IMO.
The Ricoh GXR to me fails mostly due to its optics. There is precisely one lens unit which is interesting to me – A12 28mm. (But even then it is biut too “largish.”) So modularity simply doesn’t pay off, simply because there is about one single lonely module I can buy for it. (And there is no body with built-in EVF and/or swivel LCD.) IOW, I do not see anything particularly wrong with the concept of the GXR. I have problem with the implementation.
Ricoh could also have release a m43 module…
Ulli
5 months ago |yes,the Ricoh GXR is a nice concept,but we dont hear much about new modules anymore.They should also update the body module; buffer is too small!
Thomas
5 months ago |Well if this system is used in a correct way, its the perfect camera.
Let us think about one thing: we often change the whole body just because the successor has a new sensor. So what about, we dont have to change the body but only a 1/3 as expensive adapter with the new built sensor inside? If the adapter is mainly inside the camera, basically build towards the camera, and in the end the sensor, then there is not even a increase of size.
for example: I would love to update my PEN1 with the new EM-5 sensor. Imagine there is simply a module where i change only the sensor and it would cost me like 200 bucks. Its a hotseller! I think everybody would update their old system and dont even have to buy a whole new body!
I think, if Polaroid (or the other brand there) is using this correctly, and the adapters also offer the real sensorsize (m4/3 adapter: m4/3 sensor of latest technology) then this could actually work! And its finally a innovation on the cameramarket! Imagine how many would update their old D700 now with a 32MPIx Sensor of the D800 ? And for only maybe 1000 bucks? Hotseller i tell you!
And because sensor and lens CAN stick together, Sigma could actually do their DPmerill series as sensor+lens, the size would NOT increase, and u just stick this combo that cost you maybe 500 Euro, to that body, and finished! You dont lose any image quality, and if you need high iso you just switch to the m4/3 adapter with 20/1.7 attached. And when you change your lens you actually also can change your shooting style!
if it would work, the Sony RX1 shows, this could also lead to an FullFrame adapter with attached 30/2 lens like the RX1 for lets say 1000 bucks. Thanks to the possibility to perfectly fit the lens to the sensor!
And if needed, you just switch to your travelzoom compact sensor. All just when you change the lens!
I think they should get an inovation award for this! This could lead to a brighter future for us!
Ulli
5 months ago |it sounds nice but you also have to think about data processing electronics needs to be able to keep up with the extra megapixels, and i cant imagine that Polaroid put them in the adapter too.
Anonymous
5 months ago |Yes thats the question. That brings us to the famous modular camera. An image processor, connected with a body “mainboard” that should work without any limitations. As i said, this is the first step, the next is also make the image processesor changeable and we have a modular camera. I dont know exactly how this could work technically (connection of processeor directly to the adapter?)
Because this seems to be an open source project, it could develop very fast.
The second reason i believe in this, is that there are lots of camera manufactures like Ricoh (Pentax), Samsung, Sigma, or even Casio (they still live i suppose) that could develop such a system if its open source. I mean, Ricoh already have such a system, maybe its even better because the processing is already inside, and they could enhance the systems performance all together.
I love innovations, thats why i love this idea of the modular camera.
Thomas
5 months ago |Yes thats the question. That brings us to the famous modular camera. An image processor, connected with a body “mainboard” that should work without any limitations. As i said, this is the first step, the next is also make the image processesor changeable and we have a modular camera. I dont know exactly how this could work technically (connection of processeor directly to the adapter?) but a kind of “personal Camera” where i can chose if i really need those 12fps burstrate and 70 AF points, or 4 fps and 4 AF points are enough for me and i save 100 bucks, would be the ideal.
Because this seems to be an open source project, it could develop very fast.
The second reason i believe in this, is that there are lots of camera manufactures like Ricoh (Pentax), Samsung, Sigma, or even Casio (they still live i suppose) that could develop such a system if its open source. I mean, Ricoh already have such a system, maybe its even better because the processing is already inside, and they could enhance the systems performance all together.
I love innovations, thats why i love this idea of the modular camera.
Esa Tuunanen
5 months ago |Do you have any idea how much work backwards compatibility has caused and will keep causing for example in PCs?
Maybe even AMD might be able to do really competitive new CPU (they need now two “cores” to match one of Intel’s) if they didn’t keep dragging compatibility with half dozen generations old sockets…
> …are enough for me and i save 100 bucks
All extra physical complexity and other things would no doubt increase other costs enough to negate not so much lower manufacturing cost of say less capable processor chip. (again sensor’s cost depends on very little else than size)
Crippling of lower end model could be of course also done in firmware but that wouldn’t lower really any manufacturing costs.
And the more physical configurability and customizability it has the bulkier it will be besides pricing. That’s why all electronic systems tend to go for higher integration of anything.
And Ricoh GXR is bad example of something being viable… sure it can be done but it causes equally much/more limitations than solves. No wonder that system is so limited in choises even after three years… and apparently sells about as much as Rube Goldberg machine.
You should think camera as car.
Do you get to choose various parts, design details and such as you like?
No, because only way for cars to be as affordable as today is mass production of predetermined models.
Steven Micallef
5 months ago |I like on Sakar’s own website http://www.sakar.com/products/16,cameras/101,polaroid-im1836?b=1 under the Techinal Specs they tout is as “Compact Micro 4/3 Body.”
MikeH
5 months ago |This holy grail modular camera idea has a few massive flaws in implementation.
If the body cannot be easily upgraded to a faster processor and more memory, then the body becomes obsolete just as fast as any other camera body made today, sans the ability to endlessly customize/hack/screw up the features and operation of the body.
Mating sensors to lenses for a ‘modular’ system increases the cost of each lens. An alternative would be an adapter that included the sensor between the camera and lens but this adapter would add size and weight to the system.
Creating an open operating system camera would be a system that few (if any) camera makers would want to support. Endless flavors of camera software would be a nightmare scenario. Look at closed systems like consoles… They are simple to support because there are a very limited number of possible hardware combinations and even fewer software combinations. I can easily see that the manufacturer would only support issues when the camera is ‘rolled back’ to the system default software or the current version system software.
DailyFilmFix
5 months ago |What about possiblities with live broadcasting using an android app? I saw a report for a CNN reporter the other day with his cellphone. He was talking to a Congressman and walking with him. The jello was pretty pronounced, but the sound (probably tweaked) was really excellent for the little device.
If an android camera would allow reporters in the field to send in footage on the fly, that camera could be useful. And if it could take advantage of a decent sensor and some quality glass, I could see it being purchased.
From my years attending Sundance, I can tell you audiences will put up with a lot visually but draw the line with bad sound. Kirby Dick told me in an interview that he gave small cameras to his subjects and told them to interview themselves.
There is room for lots of innovation, of course, and its the cheap consumer cams that provide a laboratory.
Camaman
5 months ago |So
1. they built a nikon 1 camera but with one special Nikon kit lens tht has sensor on it.
2. they did all this to offer a better sensor ability by giving us a m43 adapter with sensor in it, so we could use our m43 lenses.
Over complicate much?
At least now we see that if you want something strange and innovative done,its not really that expensive to make. It is more of organizing new teams. And big guys are just lazy to do so and bring their results to the market.
Maybe Nikon sold them a part of their unrealized project and they just finished it.